Wuhan Coronavirus

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jetman

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The psychopathic-natured Republican party is the guilty party here. Last time I checked it was the Forrest Gump party that blocked the bill intended to fund all-things related to the (overblown) coronavirus situation. It is the Republican party, not Dem party nor CNN that is playing politics here. As usual, when it comes to helping people in need, the baboons in the Republican party perpetually proclaim "IT'S SOCIALISM!!" That's all they ever say. It's the only argument (and a pathetic one) they use when it comes to helping people in need.

When will ya'll learn that the Republican party is the enemy? But, I luves my God! And guns! Isn't that right, huh? Oh noes, not taxes! Y'all are always proclaiming how "entitled" Dem voters are. Except, y'all are the ones who want something for nothing! Isn't that why you hate taxes? How dare we pay taxes, right? Every single thing y'all take advantage of is the direct result of taxes.

Anyway. It bewilders me how any rational thinking adult person could think the Republican party is anything but evil. Judging by the number of comments in this thread, y'all are concerned. Yet, your party is attempting to block any funding whatsoever. Surely y'all think the Republican party is in the wrong here? If not, sheesh. Wake up. If so, good.. you're going in the right direction. Now, just remember there are other people in need of help that is not related to the subject of this thread. Who are you to vote for ideologies that prevent helping those in need? Or do y'all only care when you might be affected? Good grief.. how entitled are y'all?
 
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I didn't hear that at all. He was reading a script and kept going on and off script, so it was disjointed but he looked and sounded fine.
Yeah he was fine. Typical Trump as far as being all over the place but looked and sounded as healthy as always. The whole “Trump should be tested” is ridiculous. All experts say don’t get tested unless you are showing the symptoms. Test kits are a luxury right now.
 

cowboyinexile

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Airlines are going to have to be bailed out since we have completely lost our cottonpickin minds...so are other companies in travel and entertainment related industries.

@Rack I'm taking this here because @steross wanted to make a market thread and you inadvertantly tried to derail it.

They may need to be bailed out. We don't know yet-a lot of segments may need to be bailed out because of this.

But we haven't lost our minds. This is very serious. This isn't some partisan chicken little bullshit. This is arguably the biggest national security threat we've seen since 911 or even WW2. Iran's government may fall because of this. That isn't hyperbole. They didn't take it seriously and they are in a crisis situation right now. We were late to the game in dealing with this-some of that is on Trump but for 95% of the population it's a bad cold, so I don't fault his slow response until we realized how it impacting the other 5% could really screw up life as we know it.

No one is overreacting. Even if it's a bad cold for most of us we need to make sure those with serious issues don't overwhelm the health care system. If you're in a car wreck next month it would really suck if the ER tells you sorry because they are overwhelmed by COVID 19 patients. That's a real thing in Italy right now. They are a Western country with modern health care and their doctors (that aren't sick because of this) have to make real decisions about who lives and who dies. We don't want that here.
 

Rack

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@Rack I'm taking this here because @steross wanted to make a market thread and you inadvertantly tried to derail it.

They may need to be bailed out. We don't know yet-a lot of segments may need to be bailed out because of this.

But we haven't lost our minds. This is very serious. This isn't some partisan chicken little bullshit. This is arguably the biggest national security threat we've seen since 911 or even WW2. Iran's government may fall because of this. That isn't hyperbole. They didn't take it seriously and they are in a crisis situation right now. We were late to the game in dealing with this-some of that is on Trump but for 95% of the population it's a bad cold, so I don't fault his slow response until we realized how it impacting the other 5% could really screw up life as we know it.

No one is overreacting. Even if it's a bad cold for most of us we need to make sure those with serious issues don't overwhelm the health care system. If you're in a car wreck next month it would really suck if the ER tells you sorry because they are overwhelmed by COVID 19 patients. That's a real thing in Italy right now. They are a Western country with modern health care and their doctors (that aren't sick because of this) have to make real decisions about who lives and who dies. We don't want that here.
I don't mean to be a dick about it but I really just can't see it logically...the numbers, even in china don't support this kind of radical worldwide response unless its something far more sinister. Maybe it does, just seems out there...in comparison to past events that seem similar numbers wise. I don't see it as overtly political but I do see Americans as soft and sue happy these days and that is part of what I see as overreaction. Once again, I just can't see it vs the reaction size especially if it's a natural biological from the wet market rather than a bio weapon...maybe I will in three months but right now reaction seems to be out of proportion with anything that I've seen in my 54 years of life vs what seems prudent. Just an opinion....and a disagreement.

Healthcare providers where I work have told me they want more test so they can prove that the death rate is far lower than it looks now because the people in the country with it aren't being tested due to not being symptomatic. NOT to prove that it's a huge problem that we need to stress even more about but to actually calm people down by bringing down the death rate numbers. I don't think our populace is that smart and when they see case numbers go up...which they will, they will start to panic even more.
 
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steross

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I don't mean to be a dick about it but I really just can't see it logically...the numbers, even in china don't support this kind of radical worldwide response unless its something far more sinister. Maybe it does, just seems out there...in comparison to past events that seem similar numbers wise. I don't see it as overtly political but I do see Americans as soft and sue happy these days and that is part of what I see as overreaction. Once again, I just can't see it vs the reaction size especially if it's a natural biological from the wet market rather than a bio weapon...maybe I will in three months but right now reaction seems to be out of proportion with anything that I've seen in my 54 years of life vs what seems prudent. Just an opinion....and a disagreement.

Healthcare providers where I work have told me they want more test so they can prove that the death rate is far lower than it looks now because the people in the country with it aren't being tested due to not being symptomatic. NOT to prove that it's a huge problem that we need to stress even more about but to actually calm people down by bringing down the death rate numbers. I don't think our populace is that smart and when they see case numbers go up...which they will, they will start to panic even more.
Can you not understand the idea that maybe without training in viral disease transmission, epidemiology, and public health that maybe you simply are not going to see it even though it is true?

I mean, I know a little about computers. But, I have had people start explaining things about them that just went past me. Now, I could claim that they just can't be true since I personally don't get it. But, I don't think that is the right answer.

IMG_5661.JPG
 
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Rack

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Can you not understand the idea that maybe without training in viral disease transmission, epidemiology, and public health that maybe you simply are not going to see it even though it is true?

I mean, I know a little about computers. But, I have had people start explaining things about them that just went past me. Now, I could claim that they just can't be since I personally don't get it. But, I don't think that is the right answer.

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it doesn't take an epidemiologists to look at statistics and past viral events for a logical basis of current ones...it's not illogical to run numbers and see this reaction as an overreaction from a statistical and financial standpoint..it yet remains to be seen otherwise. The difference between the ones who know it all and some of the others is that we can accept that it looks crazy but we aren't certain if it is or not because we don't yet know outcomes or the science, nor do others but they think they do. Certainly if outcomes are good it's a chicken and egg thing and we may never know if the reaction was right or not, but we have set a precedent... some of us have trouble seeing past the wake of the damage from the "cure" not knowing if other cures would have caused less damage. We all know open heart surgery requires breaking a sternum, but we don't do open heart surgery for a little blockage in a lessor artery...we do a stint because we know and have had practice with it. Not sure we needed open heart surgery or a stint here because we don't have experience with this, but they ARE cracking us open...and damn IF that's NOT stressful and hurts like hell. I'm a bad patient, what can I say...
 

steross

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it doesn't take an epidemiologists to look at statistics and past viral events for a logical basis of current ones...it's not illogical to run numbers and see this reaction as an overreaction from a statistical and financial standpoint..it yet remains to be seen otherwise. The difference between the ones who know it all and some of the others is that we can accept that it looks crazy but we aren't certain if it is or not because we don't yet know outcomes or the science, nor do others but they think they do. Certainly if outcomes are good it's a chicken and egg thing and we may never know if the reaction was right or not, but we have set a precedent... some of us have trouble seeing past the wake of the damage from the "cure" not knowing if other cures would have caused less damage. We all know open heart surgery requires breaking a sternum, but we don't do open heart surgery for a little blockage in a lessor artery...we do a stint because we know and have had practice with it. Not sure we needed open heart surgery or a stint here because we don't have experience with this, but they ARE cracking us open...and damn IF that's NOT stressful and hurts like hell. I'm a bad patient, what can I say...
You assume viral events are all the same? Do you think you are "looking at statistics" at the level of detail and knowledge as an epidemiologist? You assume that the numbers seen in the first few months of a novel pandemic will hold true through the entire pandemic? What do you mean "run numbers?" Do you think a quick look at a few mortality rates until you find the one that fits the picture you want to paint is "running the numbers?" How have you decided that influenza is a good model for a coronavirus? How can you know that your biases are not affecting your decisionmaking?

Nah, it is just a global pandemic, you don't need to be an expert in the epidemiology of infectious disease to decide what to do. Something this straightforward can be figured out by any random guy on orangepower better than those silly experts.
 

Rack

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You assume viral events are all the same? Do you think you are "looking at statistics" at the level of detail and knowledge as an epidemiologist? You assume that the numbers seen in the first few months of a novel pandemic will hold true through the entire pandemic? What do you mean "run numbers?" Do you think a quick look at a few mortality rates until you find the one that fits the picture you want to paint is "running the numbers?" How have you decided that influenza is a good model for a coronavirus? How can you know that your biases are not affecting your decisionmaking?

Nah, it is just a global pandemic, you don't need to be an expert in the epidemiology of infectious disease to decide what to do. Something this straightforward can be figured out by any random guy on orangepower better than those silly experts.
Steross - that's not what I said...I said I was a bad patient...basically I'm saying that this seems to the layperson like me that its an overreaction due to the statistics but maybe it's not...I said that we seem to be getting full on open heart surgery and that us lay people don't know if we could have gotten by with just a stint especially when looking at past guys who got a stint for what seems similar...my point is that is what is causing many in my mindset stress...its just wondering if the damage we are doing is more than the cure required. That's a normal and human reaction...no need to insult when understanding is all that is required.
 

Rack

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Look at the numbers and the dates...they are very similar numbers but they are attempting to show growth of the virus in vastly different geography and populations..so that's not an accurate comparison...the Italian number is far more significant than the US one due to the size of the regions and their populations. You can't really remove those factors. The USA is far larger and more populace. Having 12,000 cases in Italy is far more than 12,000 cases in the USA in terms of percentage of geography, stress on a system, and population.

False flag is the wrong term..should have said a misrepresentation of the facts.
 
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CPTNQUIRK

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Look at the numbers and the dates...they are very similar numbers but they are attempting to show growth of the virus in vastly different geography and populations..so that's not an accurate comparison...the Italian number is far more significant than the US one due to the size of the regions and their populations. You can't really remove those factors. The USA is far larger and more populace. Having 12,000 cases in Italy is far more than 12,000 cases in the USA in terms of percentage of geography, stress on a system, and population.

False flag is the wrong term..should have said a misrepresentation of the facts.
It doesn’t have anything to do with the size of the population initially. If you put one grain of yeast in a small vat of nutrient and you put one grain in a large vat of nutrient, the number of future yeast organisms will be the same until they become limited by the size of the vat and the amount of remaining nutrient. Both curves for coronavirus are early in the development cycle and not limited by the remaining amount of nutrient. Now if you don’t stir the nutrient (people don’t travel) the number grows more slowly. If you do stir the nutrient (people traveling locally and nationwide) the yeast will grow faster because nutrients will be more readily accessible to individual organisms.
 

steross

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@steross, I thought if plotted on a semi log chart the growth curve would be a straight line representing an exponential growth rate. But their is an upward curvature. What does this mean? That seems unnatural. Is that due to the “stirring the nutrients” from my explanation in my previous comment?
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I'm not sure the exact confounding factor but I suspect that you are seeing differences from a standard exponential growth curve due to multiple confounders. First of all, you are counting testing, not actual growth so the numbers presented are dependent on tests done not actual cases. Second, exponential growth requires constant doubling time. All of the factors of the real world (typical and now put in place to fight the spread) are going to have positive or negative effects on the doubling time.