Covid-19

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May 31, 2007
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That's fine...I don't think you are an extremists...I'm just tired of the virus killing folks and think the vaccines are the only way out. I'm not really as "worried" about it as you because I guess I believe in the vaccines I took more than maybe you do. So I have taken a plane three times and worn my mask, gone to the football game and worn an N95 and understood that flying is far more safe than many things like eating in a restaurant, which I also do. Basically I'm saying that the vaccine is freedom and refusing it is the opposite of freedom....I'm in no way virtue signaling any more than you are. I have no intention of labeling you, I'm just tired of it all, as I'm sure you are. Sorry if I offended you in any way, it wasn't my intention to offend.
It’s impossible to offend me. Just because I correct a mischaracterization doesn’t mean I’m offended. It’s just part of the give and take. This is just a time waster for me and the last thing anyone should do is take anything said here seriously. I also wasn’t specifically accusing you of virtue signaling (although it seems like you are accusing me of that which I would love to hear an elaboration on that).

As to your broader point. My worry isn’t with catching the virus it is with spreading it. If you are vaccinated and don’t care if you spread it then go to football games, fly, etcetera to your heart’s desire. You aren’t in any danger obviously. Not everyone in my immediate circle is yet eligible for the vax so I try to avoid any situation where I might pick up and then spread it to the people I’m around in my inner circle.
 
May 31, 2007
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Ignorance isn't "evil," it's believing something that is false or just not knowing. Anti-vaccine folks aren't evil, just sadly ignorant of the truth. The "evil" ones are those who pander to them and feed them half truths for political and social gain.
It doesn’t really matter if it is actually evil or not. The perception matters and how those people are treated matters. To me all of the evil lies with the MSM, social media and politicians. The rest is just regular people being regular people.
 
Sep 3, 2010
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I spend much of every Wednesday trying to get rid of type 2 diabetes. Guess what? It doesn't need a drug. They can help, but they aren't a requirement. But, it does need a person to be willing to make the changes that take them away from the lifestyle that got them to type 2 diabetes in the first place. That can be difficult in our obesigenic society and many are not willing or able.
Sounds familiar. Maybe we could mandate them to eat better and exercise. I wonder how many Covid deaths could have been avoided if folks were just healthier.
 
Sep 3, 2010
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Obviously I am anything but anti-vax since I've had two Pfizer shots and will be first in line for the booster after my recent experience. I have a few friends and even a few relatives, none of whom are conspiracy theorists that made the decision not to get vaccinated. When I discuss it with them, I acknowledge that I am also not totally comfortable with the rushed nature of developing this vaccine and that there could be issues with it down the road. I can personally attest that I got sick both times I got jabbed and had some spiking BP issues and some extreme total body muscle cramp issues in the month after the shots. To be honest, I can't say for certain they were from the vaccines or from having had Covid last Christmas for 14 days (or a combination of both) but I can say it sucked.

What I have told people in discussing this is that I had to weigh the risks and rewards as neither choice was free of risks. For myself personally at 64 years old I felt the risks and side effects of the vaccines were more survivable than the chance of getting a severe case of Covid. I survived it once with no vaccine so I could have gone with that theory but this virus is very unnatural and not like anything I have ever had (either time). It was so much worse this second time. It rams at the door to your castle (immune system), retreats and then rams again and repeats these attacks over and over for days. You can literally feel like you're past it for a day or two and it comes slamming back. For me it literally felt like a bunch of Monty Python Holy Grail characters with a giant battering ram pounding on the castle entrances trying to find one they could completely breach. I suppose the folks that end up in ICU are ones where that attack finally knocks down the gates and goes to town on your whole body. That characteristic is really is the most frightening aspect of Covid. You can think you're about past it and then it comes roaring back harder than the last time.

So for me, I am going to choose the preventatives that are available to me, despite any inherent potential side effects down the road. However, what I am totally against is the government forcing individuals or forcing businesses to force individuals to mandatorily have to take it against their will. That is overreaching, fascist and Un-American to mandate vaccines for people against their will or to "shame" or ostracize people for making a personal medical decision. Those folks might have weighed those same concerns that you and I did and made a different decision that avoiding the vaccine was best for them.

I am convinced that "viral load" and time of exposure are the key factors in contracting this virus. Had I not been in a tiny ER room a foot away from my son for 6 hours not knowing he had Covid and not Lyme disease, I think my vaccines would have kept me safe. I basically buried my face in a 6 hour Covid pie which broke the back of the preventative vaccines I had taken. I honestly think the least effective of all preventative measures is a mask. Limiting your exposure to persons outside your home to less than 15 minutes (especially in a confined space) and staying 6 ft. away from others are the two most important preventatives in my opinion. If you are bound and determined to wave the flag of the mask brigade, at least make sure it has an OSU Logo on it for goodness sake!
You had Covid in December, got vaccinated, and then got Covid again? Holy smokes man that sucks. Don’t waste your money on lottery tickets dude, this ain’t your year. Glad you’re on your way to a full recovery.
 
May 31, 2007
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You had Covid in December, got vaccinated, and then got Covid again? Holy smokes man that sucks. Don’t waste your money on lottery tickets dude, this ain’t your year. Glad you’re on your way to a full recovery.
From personal experience I can say that I knew very few people that got the 2020 strain of Covid. Well, I guess very few that got a positive test. It’s very possible many of us had it and just thought it was allergies, a cold, etcetera. But with delta I’ve known a ton of people that have had it and all of them were either vaxed or were children. That might just be a product of testing being more prevalent. Thankfully no one has had any serious issues but the coughs from the kids has been pretty gnarly.
Sounds familiar. Maybe we could mandate them to eat better and exercise. I wonder how many Covid deaths could have been avoided if folks were just healthier.
I think a really high percentage of those that died before the vaccines could have been avoided with better health choices along the way. I could elaborate but I’ll just leave it at that.
 

MustangPokeFan

Territorial Marshal
Sep 9, 2005
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Mustang, Ok
www.newshoesband.net
Obviously I am anything but anti-vax since I've had two Pfizer shots and will be first in line for the booster after my recent experience. I have a few friends and even a few relatives, none of whom are conspiracy theorists that made the decision not to get vaccinated. When I discuss it with them, I acknowledge that I am also not totally comfortable with the rushed nature of developing this vaccine and that there could be issues with it down the road. I can personally attest that I got sick both times I got jabbed and had some spiking BP issues and some extreme total body muscle cramp issues in the month after the shots. To be honest, I can't say for certain they were from the vaccines or from having had Covid last Christmas for 14 days (or a combination of both) but I can say it sucked.

What I have told people in discussing this is that I had to weigh the risks and rewards as neither choice was free of risks. For myself personally at 64 years old I felt the risks and side effects of the vaccines were more survivable than the chance of getting a severe case of Covid. I survived it once with no vaccine so I could have gone with that theory but this virus is very unnatural and not like anything I have ever had (either time). It was so much worse this second time. It rams at the door to your castle (immune system), retreats and then rams again and repeats these attacks over and over for days. You can literally feel like you're past it for a day or two and it comes slamming back. For me it literally felt like a bunch of Monty Python Holy Grail characters with a giant battering ram pounding on the castle entrances trying to find one they could completely breach. I suppose the folks that end up in ICU are ones where that attack finally knocks down the gates and goes to town on your whole body. That characteristic is really is the most frightening aspect of Covid. You can think you're about past it and then it comes roaring back harder than the last time.

So for me, I am going to choose the preventatives that are available to me, despite any inherent potential side effects down the road. However, what I am totally against is the government forcing individuals or forcing businesses to force individuals to mandatorily have to take it against their will. That is overreaching, fascist and Un-American to mandate vaccines for people against their will or to "shame" or ostracize people for making a personal medical decision. Those folks might have weighed those same concerns that you and I did and made a different decision that avoiding the vaccine was best for them.

I am convinced that "viral load" and time of exposure are the key factors in contracting this virus. Had I not been in a tiny ER room a foot away from my son for 6 hours not knowing he had Covid and not Lyme disease, I think my vaccines would have kept me safe. I basically buried my face in a 6 hour Covid pie which broke the back of the preventative vaccines I had taken. I honestly think the least effective of all preventative measures is a mask. Limiting your exposure to persons outside your home to less than 15 minutes (especially in a confined space) and staying 6 ft. away from others are the two most important preventatives in my opinion. If you are bound and determined to wave the flag of the mask brigade, at least make sure it has an OSU Logo on it for goodness sake!
You had Covid in December, got vaccinated, and then got Covid again? Holy smokes man that sucks. Don’t waste your money on lottery tickets dude, this ain’t your year. Glad you’re on your way to a full recovery.
Thanks man, I appreciate that. If you can possibly believe it, I am one week post Covid and not even over the Covid symptoms and I now have influenza B which I got from my wife. My son gave me Covid and my wife gave me the flu. I think they may be trying to get rid of me. I’ve got to say, this flu is like a paper cut compared to the Delta! I’m taking Tamiflu though which may be helping. I’m ready for the game tomorrow and I need the Cowboys to kick butt to make me feel better.!
 
Sep 3, 2010
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Thanks man, I appreciate that. If you can possibly believe it, I am one week post Covid and not even over the Covid symptoms and I now have influenza B which I got from my wife. My son gave me Covid and my wife gave me the flu. I think they may be trying to get rid of me. I’ve got to say, this flu is like a paper cut compared to the Delta! I’m taking Tamiflu though which may be helping. I’m ready for the game tomorrow and I need the Cowboys to kick butt to make me feel better.!
Your family is obviously trying to kill you:eek:.
 

LS1 Z28

Territorial Marshal
Oct 30, 2007
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https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/oklahoma-covid-cases.html

Our state's COVID numbers are slowly improving. Hopefully the delta variant surge has peaked and we'll continue to see the numbers drop in the coming weeks. We still have a long way to go, but at least we're headed in the right direction now.

Our 7-day moving average of new cases peaked at 2,806 on Aug. 30th. Today it's at 2,352.
1631540183072.png


Our 7-day moving average of hospitalizations peaked at 1,657 on Aug. 29th. Today it's at 1,484.
1631540214645.png


Our state's deaths haven't peaked yet, but that isn't unexpected since they tend to lag cases and hospitalizations. Hopefully they'll peak soon as well.
1631540250966.png
 
Sep 3, 2010
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https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-...ailure-11631548306?mod=hp_opin_pos_2#cxrecs_s

Sound data from the CDC has been especially lacking on natural immunity from prior Covid infection. On Aug. 25, Israel published the most powerful and scientifically rigorous study on the subject to date. In a sample of more than 700,000 people, natural immunity was 27 times more effective than vaccinated immunity in preventing symptomatic infections.

Despite this evidence, U.S. public health officials continue to dismiss natural immunity, insisting that those who have recovered from Covid must still get the vaccine. Policy makers and public health leaders, and the media voices that parrot them, are inexplicably sticking to their original hypothesis that natural immunity is fleeting, even as at least 15 studies show it lasts.

Meanwhile, employers fire workers with natural immunity who won’t get vaccinated. Schools disenroll students who won’t comply.

The CDC did put out a study on natural immunity last month, forcefully concluding that vaccinated immunity was 2.3 times better than natural immunity. The CDC used these results to justify telling those with natural immunity to get vaccinated.

But the rate of infection in each group was less than 0.01%, meaning infections were exceedingly rare in the short two-month time period the agency chose to study. This is odd, given there are more than a year of data available. Moreover, despite having data on all 50 states, the CDC only reported data from Kentucky. Was Kentucky the only state that produced the desired result? Why else exclude the same data from the other 49 states?

Some public health officials are afraid to acknowledge natural immunity because they fear some will choose infection over vaccination. But leaders can encourage all Americans who aren’t immune to get vaccinated and be transparent with the data at the same time.

The CDC shouldn’t fish for data to support outdated hypotheses. Heeding the robust Israeli data on natural immunity could help restore the agency’s credibility and even help vaccination efforts.


Israel also contributed a brilliant study on vaccinating children. Researchers found that one dose of the Pfizer vaccine, instead of the normal two, was 100% effective in children ages 12 to 15. Such a finding could have significant implications for achieving broad immunity in adolescents while reducing the risk of heart complications, which have been clustered around the second dose.

These are the studies U.S. public health agencies should be doing but aren’t. By any metric, the CDC has failed in its primary task of preparing the country for a pandemic and telling us how to reduce harm from the novel Covid pathogen.
 
Nov 23, 2010
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Hopefully we can reach pretty low levels before a December surge. It would also be nice if the last two big surges + vaccine minimizes how bad the next one is.

CDC has us at more than 9,500 deaths. Probably going to reach 10,000 before the end of this surge.
 
Mar 11, 2006
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I do hope the data continues to see case drop. And I hope our hospitals see relief from all the hospitalizations effecting other departments. My eldest daughter is a 2nd-year grad student and has some patients in COVID ICU. She had a patient die this morning - her first patient death. Challenging emotions for her as she met and worked with the patient and the patient's family a lot over the last few weeks. With her job requiring her to get within inches of COVID patient's faces -- I am hoping boosters get approved soon.
 
Feb 11, 2007
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Oklahoma City
https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-...ailure-11631548306?mod=hp_opin_pos_2#cxrecs_s

Sound data from the CDC has been especially lacking on natural immunity from prior Covid infection. On Aug. 25, Israel published the most powerful and scientifically rigorous study on the subject to date. In a sample of more than 700,000 people, natural immunity was 27 times more effective than vaccinated immunity in preventing symptomatic infections.

Despite this evidence, U.S. public health officials continue to dismiss natural immunity, insisting that those who have recovered from Covid must still get the vaccine. Policy makers and public health leaders, and the media voices that parrot them, are inexplicably sticking to their original hypothesis that natural immunity is fleeting, even as at least 15 studies show it lasts.

Meanwhile, employers fire workers with natural immunity who won’t get vaccinated. Schools disenroll students who won’t comply.

The CDC did put out a study on natural immunity last month, forcefully concluding that vaccinated immunity was 2.3 times better than natural immunity. The CDC used these results to justify telling those with natural immunity to get vaccinated.

But the rate of infection in each group was less than 0.01%, meaning infections were exceedingly rare in the short two-month time period the agency chose to study. This is odd, given there are more than a year of data available. Moreover, despite having data on all 50 states, the CDC only reported data from Kentucky. Was Kentucky the only state that produced the desired result? Why else exclude the same data from the other 49 states?

Some public health officials are afraid to acknowledge natural immunity because they fear some will choose infection over vaccination. But leaders can encourage all Americans who aren’t immune to get vaccinated and be transparent with the data at the same time.

The CDC shouldn’t fish for data to support outdated hypotheses. Heeding the robust Israeli data on natural immunity could help restore the agency’s credibility and even help vaccination efforts.


Israel also contributed a brilliant study on vaccinating children. Researchers found that one dose of the Pfizer vaccine, instead of the normal two, was 100% effective in children ages 12 to 15. Such a finding could have significant implications for achieving broad immunity in adolescents while reducing the risk of heart complications, which have been clustered around the second dose.

These are the studies U.S. public health agencies should be doing but aren’t. By any metric, the CDC has failed in its primary task of preparing the country for a pandemic and telling us how to reduce harm from the novel Covid pathogen.
But Israel is a very small compact country in comparison to the US and studies are much easier to do there than here. Here in the US we look worldwide for well done studies to help us here. In my opinion the CDC is doing their very best under very difficult circumstances.
 
Sep 3, 2010
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But Israel is a very small compact country in comparison to the US and studies are much easier to do there than here. Here in the US we look worldwide for well done studies to help us here. In my opinion the CDC is doing their very best under very difficult circumstances.
Is the medical community at least in agreement that natural immunity is superior to the immunity from the vaccine?
 

wrenhal

Federal Marshal
Aug 11, 2011
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But Israel is a very small compact country in comparison to the US and studies are much easier to do there than here. Here in the US we look worldwide for well done studies to help us here. In my opinion the CDC is doing their very best under very difficult circumstances.
Is the medical community at least in agreement that natural immunity is superior to the immunity from the vaccine?
Fauci is reluctant to say that when pushed, so I doubt it without Fauci being onboard with it.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
 
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