Lordy, add St. Peters Sweet 16 to 17 long years and counting

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Duke Silver

Find safe haven in a warm bathtub full of my jazz.
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Sep 17, 2004
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The coaches I listed above hadn't shown they could win big early in their careers either. Boynton HAS shown in this time he can recruit (statistically) at a level no prior coach at OSU has been able to do. As for number of years we should give him... I think 10 sounds like a good number. ;)
Leonard Hamilton could recruit
 
Nov 8, 2013
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I think that people think my statement is ridiculous kind of reinforces how much worse everything seems when you’re under a ban. We would otherwise be firmly on the bubble.


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You were right. Currently a "woulda been" Last 4 In" by Lunardi.
https://twitter.com/ESPNLunardi/status/1493315244357210115
 

LS1 Z28

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Has there ever been an at-large team with a losing record get into the tournament?
There's never been a team with .500 or worse record get into the NCAA Tournament without an automatic bid from winning their conference tournament. Lunardi's model doesn't make sense unless it's projecting us to win the majority of our remaining games.
 
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HCMB does recruit good athletes but what he has missed is a pure shooter. They tried to make Dziagwa into one but he could only get so far. I think that they have a good core of guys now but they need the guy who shoot from the outside consistently. Right now everyone wants to drive to the basket which works against some teams but when the opposite coach decides to put all 5 guys into the lane or double the person with the ball it goes bad.
 
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HCMB does recruit good athletes but what he has missed is a pure shooter. They tried to make Dziagwa into one but he could only get so far. I think that they have a good core of guys now but they need the guy who shoot from the outside consistently. Right now everyone wants to drive to the basket which works against some teams but when the opposite coach decides to put all 5 guys into the lane or double the person with the ball it goes bad.
The game saturday was one of the better that I've seen. We essentially conceded that we couldn't shoot the deep ball, so we worked inside out. Also, I really like AA running the point, Cisse at the 5, Thompson in the game, and plug and play the pieces. was the closest thing I've seen to basketball in a while. Let's hope Saturday was one of the moments where we say Boynton became more like Scott Drew and less like ford.

Yes, I know WVU sucks, but we beat a bad team like a good team should.
 

gundysburner

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At this point, Boynton hasn't shown that he's capable of this. He's way too passive during games, and is either unable to communicate his schemes effectively, or recruiting the wrong guys to run it. None of these things point to "elite". How many years (and millions of dollars) are appropriate to expect results?
The coaches I listed above hadn't shown they could win big early in their careers either. Boynton HAS shown in this time he can recruit (statistically) at a level no prior coach at OSU has been able to do. As for number of years we should give him... I think 10 sounds like a good number. ;)
You’re forgetting some of the classes Sean & TF brought in.


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Nov 8, 2013
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How do y'all feel about this general position?

We are already a damaged basketball school. Well before MB. I see 3 paths... 1) Stay with MB while he grows as a coach and rebuilds the program out of the dumpster and NCAA issues, 2) find our "Boone" financier and go get a Top 5 coach (virtually impossible, and we tried with Self already before he was damaged goods), or 3) Bail on MB, go hire someone we can afford and start over with #1.

Stay with and support MB is the best path. Chronic public MB critique will just build discontent and push us to #3 faster.

Some private chatter like this is fine. But public calls for change would be 100% backwards at this point.
 

gundysburner

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Jul 25, 2018
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How do y'all feel about this general position?

We are already a damaged basketball school. Well before MB. I see 3 paths... 1) Stay with MB while he grows as a coach and rebuilds the program out of the dumpster and NCAA issues, 2) find our "Boone" financier and go get a Top 5 coach (virtually impossible, and we tried with Self already before he was damaged goods), or 3) Bail on MB, go hire someone we can afford and start over with #1.

Stay with and support MB is the best path. Chronic public MB critique will just build discontent and push us to #3 faster.

Some private chatter like this is fine. But public calls for change would be 100% backwards at this point.
Only bone to pick with that is that #1 is strictly an assumption at this point.

Men's BB has to be a money maker, given that it and FB are the only two that'll every make any money for the entire department. Letting it flounder and become less profitable is not an option.
 
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Only bone to pick with that is that #1 is strictly an assumption at this point.

Men's BB has to be a money maker, given that it and FB are the only two that'll every make any money for the entire department. Letting it flounder and become less profitable is not an option.
That's fair. I feel the chances of #1 being the path back to success are far higher and much quicker than #3. But it is an assumption on my part for sure.
 

gundysburner

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That's fair. I feel the chances of #1 being the path back to success are far higher and much quicker than #3. But it is an assumption on my part for sure.
I guess I'd also argue that #3 isn't 'bailing' on the program, but rather the opposite. Bailing on the program is letting it get to a point where the expectations have been reduced below what they were previously. Bailing is accepting the overall mediocre history of OSU BB and saying 'well, who would want this job anyway?, so let's stick with the guy taking us nowhere.

We always get into the same issues, every time there's discussion about moving on from a coach. You have the crowd that wants to fire everybody, then you've got the 'you can't fire this guy unless you have some proven replacement' crowd. The simple truth that we all know is that it's a gamble anytime you replace a coach.

I'm not saying the time is now to get rid of Boynton, but I also know that turning around a BB program is a helluva lot easier than some other sports. If you've got 'the guy', it usually shows up somewhat clearly in his first couple of years.
 
Nov 18, 2010
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How do y'all feel about this general position?

Stay with and support MB is the best path. Chronic public MB critique will just build discontent and push us to #3 faster.

Some private chatter like this is fine. But public calls for change would be 100% backwards at this point.
Your 'best case scenario' for OSU basketball requires a young head coach to accept that he's doing things the wrong way. This young coach would then have to accept that someone else is a better coach, and accept advice from that better coach. Then, he'd have to execute someone else's ideas, keeping his own ego in check, resisting his own instincts, for months and months, even years, while the results of his new coaching technique takes hold.

Does that sound like something that's likely to happen?

Boyton has us once again in 7th place out of 10 teams. We have averaged a 7th place finish for five years with him as our coach. And this makes you believe he deserves another FIVE years employment at 3 million dollars a year.

This is a public call for change.
 
Dec 9, 2013
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Your 'best case scenario' for OSU basketball requires a young head coach to accept that he's doing things the wrong way. This young coach would then have to accept that someone else is a better coach, and accept advice from that better coach. Then, he'd have to execute someone else's ideas, keeping his own ego in check, resisting his own instincts, for months and months, even years, while the results of his new coaching technique takes hold.

Does that sound like something that's likely to happen?

Boyton has us once again in 7th place out of 10 teams. We have averaged a 7th place finish for five years with him as our coach. And this makes you believe he deserves another FIVE years employment at 3 million dollars a year.

This is a public call for change.
I am a pessimist by nature but I so want OSU to be good at basketball and w Boynton There is zero reason why we can’t be if he starts to learn from the past and starts to progress. Given the past 5 seasons I don’t know if that’s likely. If Baylor and Tech can be good, we can be as good (yes I know one finished 2nd and the other 1st).

At the midpoint of this year you could see we were still making the same mistakes on the floor and in game/program management. I still felt like Boynton deserved next year.

Here’s the pessimism. Best case scenario, we keep roster pretty much in tact minus Williams and maybe Donavon, Kouma and Harris. Again best case scenario w this roster do we finish higher than 5th?

Worst case scenario Cisse leaves to make $ (G league, overseas or maybe but not likely yet NBA). Then 2 or 3 of the following enter the portal (AA, both Boones, Walker, MAM). I think given the abysmal roster handling and player development who would really be surprised. You could easily be left w Ice (CoVid yr), Smith, Thompson, Newton and 1 or 2 who don’t transfer. With such a depleted roster and no player development we would be lucky to finish 7th. You have to move on then right?
 
Nov 8, 2013
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I guess I'd also argue that #3 isn't 'bailing' on the program, but rather the opposite. Bailing on the program is letting it get to a point where the expectations have been reduced below what they were previously. Bailing is accepting the overall mediocre history of OSU BB and saying 'well, who would want this job anyway?, so let's stick with the guy taking us nowhere.

We always get into the same issues, every time there's discussion about moving on from a coach. You have the crowd that wants to fire everybody, then you've got the 'you can't fire this guy unless you have some proven replacement' crowd. The simple truth that we all know is that it's a gamble anytime you replace a coach.

I'm not saying the time is now to get rid of Boynton, but I also know that turning around a BB program is a helluva lot easier than some other sports. If you've got 'the guy', it usually shows up somewhat clearly in his first couple of years.
When I said "bail on MB" on #3, I meant bail on Boynton, not on men's basketball. Sorry for the confusion.

Of course I think that option is foolish at this time. Some of you think otherwise.
 

LS1 Z28

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Oct 30, 2007
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How do y'all feel about this general position?

We are already a damaged basketball school. Well before MB. I see 3 paths... 1) Stay with MB while he grows as a coach and rebuilds the program out of the dumpster and NCAA issues, 2) find our "Boone" financier and go get a Top 5 coach (virtually impossible, and we tried with Self already before he was damaged goods), or 3) Bail on MB, go hire someone we can afford and start over with #1.

Stay with and support MB is the best path. Chronic public MB critique will just build discontent and push us to #3 faster.

Some private chatter like this is fine. But public calls for change would be 100% backwards at this point.
Coach Boynton signed a 7 year $21M contract last year. I haven't seen the fine print, but it was reported that he would make $2.825M total this year. That salary puts him right outside of the top 25 in the country. For reference, Scott Drew makes $3.35M per year.

The point I'm trying to make is simple. The time for Coach Boynton to learn on the job is over. It's now time for him to produce. If things don't work out, we can find a happy medium between buying a top 5 coach and hiring someone without any head coaching experience.

All that being said, I support him getting a sixth year due to the circumstances surrounding this one. I won't support a seventh if we don't get back to the NCAA Tournament though.