Mad at Gundy threads merged

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Oct 30, 2007
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#41
We recruit at a high level in basketball, baseball, wrestling, golf, & tennis. We even recruit football offensive skill players at a high level. It's funny how the "It's just too hard to recruit to Stillwater" excuse tends to come up with offensive lineman & defensive players. Maybe it has more to do with who is doing the recruiting than where they're recruiting to.

We'll never recruit like a blue blood program, but we're definitely capable of recruiting at a higher level than what we have over the past few years. Coach Gundy recruited a top 20 class in his first year when we were coming off a 4-7 season and playing in rustoleum stadium. There's no excuse for why he can't do the same thing now. He just needs the right coaching staff in place to do it.
Agreed, except I would add that he has to work at it.


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Jan 8, 2009
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#42
The Big 12 is a QB league. You won or lose with your QB. Last year this board was calling for a QB start by the current starter Mr Turnover. Sanders was a a high school standout in Texas. He should be able to play on the Big 12 stage but the last two games show Corndog was not a bad QB after all. We have a lot of talent on both sides of the ball but our fortunes ride on the QB. Some times you get what you think other times you do not. I hope the QB can rebuild his confidence in himself and in us or its going to be a long sad season as we head to the bottom of the Big 12.

Im not happy but this is what happens when your depth is like ours.
 
Nov 18, 2011
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#43
The Big 12 is a QB league. You won or lose with your QB. Last year this board was calling for a QB start by the current starter Mr Turnover. Sanders was a a high school standout in Texas. He should be able to play on the Big 12 stage but the last two games show Corndog was not a bad QB after all..
Uh, last year was not good either, 6-6 just to remind. Maybe if we had given another QB some experience instead of wasting the entire year on a 5th year senior even after it was long gone.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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#44
Les was the right guy at the time. Then his time passed. Gundy was the right guy at the time. His time has now passed. He was the best we ever had, but he is not that guy now. For those that keep saying it could be worse, we are second to last in the Big 12. Can't get much worse.
 
Nov 14, 2010
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#45
If Gundy truly thinks that a qb needs 15 games to be able to run his offense, then, last year, after it became obvious we weren't winning anything, Sanders should have played every snap.

Making an obscure bowl does absolutely nothing for this program other than it costing them money.

Having 2 piss poor seasons in a row is much more devastating.

Not taking our medicine last year, and going through these growing pains then instead of now really sucks.
 
Sep 24, 2011
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#46
Gundy made a change early in his tenure, then changed back. That is the big change that is killing us. There is no question our recruiting is sub par for the Big 12. Has been for years. This shows up most in the OL. Big bad offensive linemen are swallowed up by the big boys of college football. We don't get them in the numbers to compete.

Gundy saw this early, brought in Dana H., and went to the wide open spread. We were able to run the ball because we could spread it out and throw it. That was the big equalizer for not having enough big bad OL. But slowly, Mr. Conservative inside of Gundy took over and he began to believe we could become a running team. He spoke about it often. So while we have been running the ball, we can't sustain enough drives, especially in the red zone, to win. Teams are stacking the line, playing one on one on our receivers, and limiting our offense. Baylor was a great example of this.

So two things have happened. We abandoned the spread and are not getting quarterbacks that can run the spread. We don't need dual threat qb's. We need qb's that can quickly and correctly read a defense, then make accurate throws. The counter to an all out rush is the Joseph Randle run. The holes are there not because of a great OL, but because the defense is on its heels defending the pass.

The spread offense was the big equalizer we had for a lack of recruiting. It covered over defensive deficiencies. It covered over sub par OL's. We came within a eye lash of playing for an NC with it. Gundy changed it, and it is killing us now.
 
Nov 18, 2011
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#48
It’s not as hard as some might think to get rid of Gundy. Holder just needs to get involved and force some things like hiring, scheduling, etc. He can’t stand to be managed and told what to do. Gundy would leave on his own for one of those other jobs like he’s almost done a couple times already. Although his stock has taken a hit the last couple years and just continues to drop, but schools are always after someone with HC experience and past success, even if it’s way back.
 

Jostate

CPTNQUIRK called me a greenhorn
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Jun 24, 2005
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#49
As others have posted, the fire Gundy discussion is an inevitable topic, but in reality it's not likely. We've got a prenup with Gundy that makes it too expensive to get divorced.

So when he sports the midlife crisis hair style and makes us think about getting out, all we can do is look at old pics and talk to our friends about how sexy he was in his high school football uniform.
 
#50
Gundy once proclaimed that he was "a man". And, back then, he acted like one.

The mid-life crisis version of Gundy is something entirely different. From the absurd and embarrassing hairstyle (it was fun for about half a season when we thought it was just a joke) to the complete inability to hire/recruit/coach, it is incredibly obvious that he isn't interested in working hard enough to build a program that can have sustained success.

Nothing is going to change until he has an epiphany (unlikely, since he's far too narcissistic) or we make a change. It's a choice - continued mediocrity, or worse, backsliding to irrelevance or change. Change has risk and isn't easy, but it it the right choice here and now.
 

oks10

Territorial Marshal
Sep 9, 2007
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#52
Can we just have THIS Mike Gundy back? The one that actually had some fire and and wanted to win games, posting up incredibly yardage and point totals and nearly taking us to a National Championship game? The one NOT worried about his hair, smoothies or slamming social media??


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Dec 20, 2015
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#53
Here’s the problem with getting someone to replace Gundy. If we get someone that turns out to be really good (Les Miles, Jimmy Johnson) this is just a stepping stone job. If we get someone that wants to stay we’re probably not winning anymore games than we are now. There’s a reason we hire so many ex-OSU people to these positions.
 
Nov 14, 2010
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#54
Here’s the problem with getting someone to replace Gundy. If we get someone that turns out to be really good (Les Miles, Jimmy Johnson) this is just a stepping stone job. If we get someone that wants to stay we’re probably not winning anymore games than we are now. There’s a reason we hire so many ex-OSU people to these positions.
This defeatist attitude has to be removed from OSU.

How many coaches have we hired under the current setup?

Jimmy Johnson, Les Miles etc.... Didn't make $5 million a year and have the facilities we have now

Under your assumption

Why has Matt Campbell, Bill Snyder, Gary Patterson, Frank Beamer and Mike Gundy etc.... all stayed?

The trend is to stay, not leave

You can stay at a place like OSU now and make the same money, but have greater job security.

Ohio State, Notre Dame LSU, UCLA, Nebraska, OU, Texas, Oregon aren't hiring from places like OSU

They're hiring from the group of 5 teams.

OSU is no longer a stepping stone type job anymore
 
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Nov 21, 2018
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#55
Given Gundy’s contact complexities, we’d be better off trying to fire Holder. If Holder feels the heat, maybe the turd will roll down hill toward Gundy. In other words, I don’t think Holder will force a change unless his job is in jeopardy. However, I think Holder has done a good job in most aspects of his job. But he has punted the Travis Ford and Gundy contract deals. Probably the two biggest deals ever entrusted to his office.


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RutherfordFan

Federal Marshal
Feb 5, 2008
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#56
I'll bite.

First, I'm not happy with the last two seasons either. That being said, I don't think we can do better than Gundy. I don't believe anyone else will be able to consistently recruit to OSU at a higher level than Gundy. Our recruiting budget+location+program status are a lot to overcome and I think we have reached our plateau. We are an 8-9 win a year program with some 10/11s and 6/7s mixed in.

I think you, like many of us, overestimate the appeal of OSU and Stillwater to national recruits.

Lastly, I'm not a fan of making a change for the sake of making a change. So I'll ask, who do you have in mind that would, do a better job than Gundy, want to come to OSU, and be affordable?
Lol this might be the dumbest rational I see from some in our fanbase. We are a bottom 4 team this year. We could have hired Todd Monken as head coach one point. Lincoln Riley when he was young o.c. at East Carolina. Matt Rule or the Iowa state coach Campbell who is now kicking our ass too. Gundy has lost it. Boynton recruits studs, Holiday does, golf coach does. Wrestling coach does. I dont expect to recruit top 15 classes in football but top 30 should be expectation and Gundy can't do that. He's not that great. He's a solid coach who had 2 great o.c s in Holgerson and Monken. I'll give him some credit on that front. Gundy is a solid coach but below average recruiter.
 

Jostate

CPTNQUIRK called me a greenhorn
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Jun 24, 2005
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#57
Given Gundy’s contact complexities, we’d be better off trying to fire Holder.

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lol. Stopped reading here.

Maybe we could announce the firing at the grand opening of the new baseball stadium.
 
Nov 3, 2004
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#58
This defeatist attitude has to be removed from OSU.

How many coaches have we hired under the current setup?

Jimmy Johnson, Les Miles etc.... Didn't make $5 million a year and have the facilities we have now

Under your assumption

Why has Matt Campbell, Bill Snyder, Gary Patterson, Frank Beamer and Mike Gundy etc.... all stayed?

The trend is to stay, not leave

You can stay at a place like OSU now and make the same money, but have greater job security.

Ohio State, LSU, UCLA, Nebraska, OU, Texas, Oregon aren't hiring from places like OSU

They're hiring from the group of 5 teams.

OSU is no longer a stepping stone type job anymore
I 100% agree. I’d also add that the “keep Gundy because he will stay here” sentiment is the same crappy “logic” that Gundy uses with assistants. When you hire (or keep) someone that no one else will hire away, you get someone that no one else wants to hire away.
 
Nov 14, 2010
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#59
Gundy made a change early in his tenure, then changed back. That is the big change that is killing us. There is no question our recruiting is sub par for the Big 12. Has been for years. This shows up most in the OL. Big bad offensive linemen are swallowed up by the big boys of college football. We don't get them in the numbers to compete.

Gundy saw this early, brought in Dana H., and went to the wide open spread. We were able to run the ball because we could spread it out and throw it. That was the big equalizer for not having enough big bad OL. But slowly, Mr. Conservative inside of Gundy took over and he began to believe we could become a running team. He spoke about it often. So while we have been running the ball, we can't sustain enough drives, especially in the red zone, to win. Teams are stacking the line, playing one on one on our receivers, and limiting our offense. Baylor was a great example of this.

So two things have happened. We abandoned the spread and are not getting quarterbacks that can run the spread. We don't need dual threat qb's. We need qb's that can quickly and correctly read a defense, then make accurate throws. The counter to an all out rush is the Joseph Randle run. The holes are there not because of a great OL, but because the defense is on its heels defending the pass.

The spread offense was the big equalizer we had for a lack of recruiting. It covered over defensive deficiencies. It covered over sub par OL's. We came within a eye lash of playing for an NC with it. Gundy changed it, and it is killing us now.
Very nice

Under Gundy we've had a read option offense with Fedora, and the Air Raid under Holgorsen and Monken.

Lincoln Riley has successfully combined those 2 offenses into what they have now and a dual threat qb is close to unstoppable if x and o'd properly.

I don't understand Gundy's insistence on playing offense like it's the 80's again.

I know why he's doing it because teams have gone back to playing the 3-4 like so many defenses did in the 80's

But....
The 3-4 is so versatile, it can be implemented in so many differrent ways that it can't be used as a comparison.

For instance, In the 80's, teams would attach their olb's and in essence, be playing the 5-2 okie.

That's why Gundy is utilizing more Tight Ends and fullbacks.

But....that's not how, by in large, teams implement the 3-4 now against these spread offenses.

It's very frustrating to watch Gundy get this wrong.
 
Nov 3, 2004
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#60
Gundy never chose to hire Holgerson. It was forced on him. When he hired Yurcich, he said that he wanted to stop the revolving door of OC that resulted from us having a superb offense. IMO he never liked that someone other than him was getting credit for the success.
 
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