So Much for "All Men Are Created Equal"?

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metallicajake

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Feb 8, 2007
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"Let every person be in subjection to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God.
vs2 Therefore he who resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves.
"and those which exist are established by God." blah blah blah.

God who? which God? is this statement in the Qur'an? the Torah? is it universally accepted by very man, woman, and child in the US?

if not, then please don't cite it as "proof" or "reasoning" for anything civil.
 

steross

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i brought up the notion of why prostitution is illegal once, and came to the conclusion that it is a health risk more than a morality problem. also, it puts women in a terrible position to have something bad happen to them. there are a lot of sick people out there.
For streetwalkers that is true. For the legal and highly regulated Nevada brothels, not so much. The women are just as safe as a masseuse at a spa. With weekly health checks and mandatory condom use, the health risks are limited. Definitely a safer job than working an oilfield or mine.
 

metallicajake

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I'm just a guy with a couple of kids trying to be a good Daddy and to point my children down the right path with the proper barries in place to keep them safe and sound in a world where other think they should live outside the boundries.
right, and kudos to you for being a good father.

but, i would guess that you don't want them to be gay.
 

metallicajake

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For streetwalkers that is true. For the legal and highly regulated Nevada brothels, not so much. The women are just as safe as a masseuse at a spa. With weekly health checks and mandatory condom use, the health risks are limited. Definitely a safer job than working an oilfield or mine.
right. there you go. a perfectly logical explanation of a law some would cite as "proof that we make laws based on morals".
 

Cimarron

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"and those which exist are established by God." blah blah blah.

God who? which God? is this statement in the Qur'an? the Torah? is it universally accepted by very man, woman, and child in the US?

if not, then please don't cite it as "proof" or "reasoning" for anything civil.
Well..... it was taken from the Bible and not the Qur'an etc......
 

metallicajake

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It's funny that you are talking about Jewish law. Is anybody here Jewish? You forget that the law given to the Jews by Moses from God for JEWISH people. Not all people. The law given to Moses is to "set apart" the Jewish nation as God's people.
damn that pesky American ideal of giving the people a nation in which all peoples can worship freely!

That is the flaw you have about the Law of Moses. Even the Jews couldn't follow it and they have paid dearly for not recognizing the reason for the law. You have to have Jesus, as your Messiah, or you will die according to God's wrath on sin.
hrmm... are you friends with Sean Hannity?
 

snuffy

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We do have something to offer them, we offer them opportunity to repent their sins (homosexuality) and seek Jesus Christ. I don't think by allowing homosexuals to enter into the sacred covenant of marriage, we are doing what Jesus would want us to do. There is a reason why in the Bible it is says marriage is a union of man and woman.

If we don't govern on the word of God, tell me why prostitution is illegal? pornography? etc. All of these are moral issues, they harm nobody.
Who is we buddy? God does that, not you. You may get to carry the message, but you have nothing to offer except a road map. A map whose image a be diminished by those who give it out when they stand in judgment and wag the finger of scorn on others,
 
Dec 15, 2003
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I thoroughly disagree with your interpretation, and I think Paul does, too.
You should provide more proof of that. I believe the scripture is telling us to submit to the "governing authorities" because God has placed them in the position of authority over us on earth. How exactly is that separate?
 
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damn that pesky American ideal of giving the people a nation in which all peoples can worship freely!



hrmm... are you friends with Sean Hannity?
Your post does not make any sense at all. I'm talking about Jewish law and how the Jewish people are to follow it to set them apart from the rest of the world. What exactly does that have to do with people worshipping freely?

I don't know who Sean Hannity is so I couldn't be friends with the person. However, I can tell you that Jesus told the Jews that they missed out and then opened up His kingdom for the rest of the world because of their (Jews) lack of faith.

Matthew 22:1-14 speaks exactly how God saw Israel and how the Gentiles are accepted into the Kingdom of God.

Matthew 22
The Parable of the Wedding Banquet
1Jesus spoke to them again in parables, saying: 2"The kingdom of heaven is like a king who prepared a wedding banquet for his son. 3He sent his servants to those who had been invited to the banquet to tell them to come, but they refused to come.

4"Then he sent some more servants and said, 'Tell those who have been invited that I have prepared my dinner: My oxen and fattened cattle have been butchered, and everything is ready. Come to the wedding banquet.'

5"But they paid no attention and went off—one to his field, another to his business. 6The rest seized his servants, mistreated them and killed them. 7The king was enraged. He sent his army and destroyed those murderers and burned their city.

8"Then he said to his servants, 'The wedding banquet is ready, but those I invited did not deserve to come. 9Go to the street corners and invite to the banquet anyone you find.' 10So the servants went out into the streets and gathered all the people they could find, both good and bad, and the wedding hall was filled with guests.

11"But when the king came in to see the guests, he noticed a man there who was not wearing wedding clothes. 12'Friend,' he asked, 'how did you get in here without wedding clothes?' The man was speechless.

13"Then the king told the attendants, 'Tie him hand and foot, and throw him outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'

14"For many are invited, but few are chosen."
 

Cimarron

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ok, well not everyone in the US follows the Bible. some follow the Qur'an, some follow the Torah, some don't follow anything at all.

and yet you think it right to use it as basis for the laws of those people?
In a society that is basically Christian, yes. As I have said before a society is pulled together with people that have the same basic values and morals. That is why they live where they do. That is why you choose many of the friends that you do.

I don't prefer to live in a society that has different values and morals. I don't believe that a society can be strong when within that same society or government there is one law for you and another different law for me.
 
Dec 15, 2003
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you were citing a difference between *your* law and Jewish law, were you not?
You got me. There is a difference between the Jewish law and "my" law. The difference is, I can eat things they cannot and wear clothes that they cannot. :rolleyes:

How exactly does that deal with worshipping freely?
 

panhandler62

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You got me. There is a difference between the Jewish law and "my" law. The difference is, I can eat things they cannot and wear clothes that they cannot. :rolleyes:

How exactly does that deal with worshipping freely?
It doesn't.

What does effect our religious freedom is a governing interest in religion. If we begin to justify our law based on a particular religious tradition then we are, in fact if not name, establishing a state religion.

That doesn't sound to bad if that is *your* religion being established, but I think most of us would be right put out if we started seeing statutory law premised on the Sharia.
 

JLK Jr.

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Oct 12, 2007
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It doesn't.

If we begin to justify our law based on a particular religious tradition then we are, in fact if not name, establishing a state religion.

That doesn't sound to bad if that is *your* religion being established, but I think most of us would be right put out if we started seeing statutory law premised on the Sharia.
Exactly right.
 
Dec 15, 2003
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It doesn't.

What does effect our religious freedom is a governing interest in religion. If we begin to justify our law based on a particular religious tradition then we are, in fact if not name, establishing a state religion.

That doesn't sound to bad if that is *your* religion being established, but I think most of us would be right put out if we started seeing statutory law premised on the Sharia.
People vote to their opinions, no?

If my opinion is to keep sexual immortality at bay as much as possible because of my "religion," then it is my option to do so. No?