Who can agree that....

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LS1 Z28

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#41
I've always believed that we would be better off without the party system. Independents make up over 40% of all voters, and there are moderates in both parties. I've never understood why we don't have more moderate and centrist politicians since they would represent the majority of our population.
 
May 4, 2011
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#42
Also the way they control who is on the ballot. I believe it was after the 1992 election when they made it virtually impossible for a 3rd party candidate to even get on the ballot and also eliminated the write-in.
That's somewhat specific to Oklahoma. Lived in several other stated and Oklahoma has by far the most restrictive laws for 3rd party candidates, which I now just see as a way for Republicans to maintain their single party rule.
 

Duke Silver

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#43
That's somewhat specific to Oklahoma. Lived in several other stated and Oklahoma has by far the most restrictive laws for 3rd party candidates, which I now just see as a way for Republicans to maintain their single party rule.
Not anymore
 

naffigator

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#45
That's somewhat specific to Oklahoma. Lived in several other stated and Oklahoma has by far the most restrictive laws for 3rd party candidates, which I now just see as a way for Republicans to maintain their single party rule.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but back in the 90's when those restrictive laws were put into effect, the Democrats controlled the Oklahoma Legislature but to be fair I'm sure they couldn't have done it without Republican help. Your immediate blame of Republicans is a large part of the problem. So many people refuse to vote for a third party because they are scared the "other" party will take over and ruin everything so they vote for "their" party no matter what.
 

CowboyJD

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#46
I mean here in our own state we have a GREAT example of the parties only caring about power.

Joy Hoffemister is switching parties just to run against Stitt as a Democrat. She is fully 100% "Republican" but she will switch just to have a go at the power. The actual values, beliefs, and wants of the PEOPLE of the parties is NOT in line with ANY politician today. The D or R by their name, is just a way for them to either get votes based on Tribe OR to give them a shot at power to unseat someone else....that is it....That is ALL a D or R next to most of their names means to them. They don't subscribe to the value and belief systems at all. Politicians have actually created their OWN value and belief systems at the expense of the parties they have destroyed
There is actually a LONG history of this kind of thing in American politics.

I’m listening to a podcast called “Wicked Game” that discuses every single Presidential election in detail. After Alexander Hamilton was shot and killed by Aaron Burr, the Federalists were rudderless and without any leadership. They realized they had no chance of electing a Federalist and at one point even officially endorsed the “less bad” of Republican candidates.
 

CowboyJD

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#47
Though it has been loosened some, Oklahoma is still quite restrictive on 3rd party candidates and 3rd parties qualify for ballots and staying on the ballot. More than most states still.
 

CowboyJD

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#48
I've always believed that we would be better off without the party system. Independents make up over 40% of all voters, and there are moderates in both parties. I've never understood why we don't have more moderate and centrist politicians since they would represent the majority of our population.
Primary process and third party ballot restrictions.
 
May 4, 2011
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#49
Sorry to burst your bubble, but back in the 90's when those restrictive laws were put into effect, the Democrats controlled the Oklahoma Legislature but to be fair I'm sure they couldn't have done it without Republican help. Your immediate blame of Republicans is a large part of the problem. So many people refuse to vote for a third party because they are scared the "other" party will take over and ruin everything so they vote for "their" party no matter what.
Not bursting my bubble. Just because one party put in place, that doesn't mean the other doesn't hold onto it for their own benefit now that they control basically everything in Oklahoma.

For what its it's worth, Oklahoma has sent only one democratic senator to Washington since 1973 and that's Boren. It's voted only republican for president since Nixon. The state was clearly flipping even more Republican in the 90s and the party now has a stranglehold on the state, much like Democrats do in California or New York.

The effect of those rules now is that your only chance at influencing who wins an election is in republican primaries, elections for which turnout is low and made lower by restricting primary voting to only registered Republicans. By limiting third party and independent candidates, it then limits the options of who has a legitimate shot at the subsequent general election to basically only the Republican nominee. Living in other states, I really was surprised at how much easier it is to vote in another party's primary or to have a third party on the ballot.
 

OranGE-KK

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#50
I've been able to vote in presidential elections for 20 years now. Literally the only time I get to vote for who I want to see in office is in the primary (they're usually already dead in the water at that point...).
I actually have started seeing commercials geared toward the '22 election that aren't actually FOR any candidate. It's basically a few minutes of "F this guy"
 

kenny41

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#51
The older I get the more I see that leadership is every bit as important ideology. Sadly we haven’t had any good leadership in quite some time. We’ve got by and large an old, stale patrician class congress that are slaves to lobbyists, special interests, and money grabs. We keep getting presidents that push their executive power because congress is so shitty. Now people’s expectations of what the president needs to be is quite different than what their authority was originally intended to be. The political circus we’ve made the election process not only doesn’t yield the leadership we need, but also pushes away others that would be more qualified. We’ve now got a political duopoly that’s only designed to keep their base outraged at the other side and not produce common ground solutions. Now all we do is try to burn down partisan policies from previous regime changes that keeps us from building common ground and makes diplomacy around the world less effective. There’s a system wide failure that bleeds into the state and local level. It just gets more corrupt the more local it gets.
 
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llcoolw

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#53
Looks like a lot of people are seeing the truth. It’s getting easier to see. The dividers are still trying but people are realizing that hating people you don’t even know just isn’t good for you. To be fair, there really is a division we need to promote. We need to divide ourselves away from career politicians.
 
Mar 11, 2006
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#54
If you are asking if I think both the GOP and the Dems have their far-right and far-left base becoming more extreme… then my answer is a definitive yes.

If you are asking if I think the GOP and the Dems overall political parties are a parody .. then I am not as passionate with an answer. I think although mainstream GOP and Dems have evolved over time, I don’t see their platforms as much different than when I first started following politics in the 80s. And dirty politics by both is nothing new. I think with social media we learn about more salacious rumors. And some people confuse the extremists with the mainstream of each party.
 
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CowboyJD

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#60
If you are asking if I think both the GOP and the Dems have their far-right and far-left base becoming more extreme… then my answer is a definitive yes.

If you are asking if I think the GOP and the Dems overall political parties are a parody .. then I am not as passionate with an answer. I think although mainstream GOP and Dems have evolved over time, I don’t see their platforms as much different than when I first started following politics in the 80s. And dirty politics by both is nothing new. I think with social media we learn about more salacious rumors. And some people confuse the extremists with the mainstream of each party.
Word salad, but no co-sign.

Got it.