Mad at Gundy threads merged

  • You are viewing Orangepower as a Guest. To start new threads, reply to posts, or participate in polls or contests - you must register. Registration is free and easy. Click Here to register.
Status
Not open for further replies.

jetman

Federal Marshal
Nov 27, 2004
13,344
8,794
1,743
Edmond Oklahoma
I didn't expect that much of a rebuilding year. I expected an improvement over last year and being the sleeper team in the conference. Some of that was because of Gundy talking about his renewed since of focus over the summer which is turning out to be BS. Now we are supposed to believe what he is saying?
 

jetman

Federal Marshal
Nov 27, 2004
13,344
8,794
1,743
Edmond Oklahoma
1. How about letting the DC bring in his guys instead of using the tried and true set we currently have now. The whole Defensive staff sans Greg Richmond were here prior to Knowles and I'm pretty sure Knowles didn't hire him either. Let him bring in his guys if he is going to be the DC. I would hate to rely on guys that aren't/weren't familiar with the system I am trying to run with my head on the chopping block.
All the rest I agree with.
Seems like we are stuck in perpetual "let so and so coach bring in their own guys" mode. It never ends.
 
Aug 22, 2006
1,339
489
1,713
SE Oklahoma
1. How about letting the DC bring in his guys instead of using the tried and true set we currently have now. The whole Defensive staff sans Greg Richmond were here prior to Knowles and I'm pretty sure Knowles didn't hire him either. Let him bring in his guys if he is going to be the DC. I would hate to rely on guys that aren't/weren't familiar with the system I am trying to run with my head on the chopping block.
All the rest I agree with.
Seems like we are stuck in perpetual "let so and so coach bring in their own guys" mode. It never ends.
When was the last time that actually happened? We aren't hiring new coaches perpetually. We hire new coordinators and bitch because nothing changes, maybe try some position coaches.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
 

CaymanS

Greenhorn
Oct 20, 2018
48
16
58
59
OKC
We need another thread because everyone is intent on explaining the bigger issue away......the bigger issue is complacency. When you put a guy in charge of something, pay him a massive amount of money for over a decade and teach him that his decisions can’t be questioned, you get what we have now.....”Good Enough”....7-9 wins a season? Good Enough! 5 million a year HC and great facilities within 3 hours of Tx, but we still keep falling behind our competitors? Good Enough! Chance to hire talented, proven coaching assets but instead opt for a bunch of unknown, unproven “yes men” to coach and recruit? Good Enough! etc.
But we haven't been in trouble with the NCAA, and we have graduated and developed a bunch of great men, and who else are you going to get, and he's the 'winningest coach' in OSU history, recruiting stars and rankings don't mean anything, it's hard to get anyone to come to Stillwater, and we've gone to a bowl xxx times in a row and be careful what you ask for. Have I left off any of the deflective explanations for where we are now ? Rack might want to add a few.
 

jetman

Federal Marshal
Nov 27, 2004
13,344
8,794
1,743
Edmond Oklahoma
When was the last time that actually happened? We aren't hiring new coaches perpetually. We hire new coordinators and bitch because nothing changes, maybe try some position coaches.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
We've heard that about to Oline since Wickline left and I hear people saying it about Gleason now in addition to Knowles. So that why I say it seems like we're stuck in perpetual "wait until they get their guys in there."
 
Oct 17, 2003
724
10
1,568
Cayman you understand my frustration, your post describes the apologist-attitude of many supporters here.....”at least we did/didn’t xxxxx” “who else would/could xxx”. We’re “good enough” right now, as good as we can ever be!”

BS
 

CaymanS

Greenhorn
Oct 20, 2018
48
16
58
59
OKC
Damn straight I will...we want to be a job that pays the going rate...certainly we ALL want better results. He's paid specifically for his past results and what he's been doing on the academic front as well. We will improve or he won't be here long term (by long term I mean past 2022). It's sort of a non-emotional thing...not sure why so many get all wrapped up in emotion when they don't understand the ins and outs of the daily grind in the first place.
Great he's in the 30-40s in recruiting rankings, and 5th in the conference the past 4 years, but, of course, under your selective criteria he's earning a top 15 salary for less than top 15 results. This is why our program is going stale and schools like even freaking KU are beating us in recruiting because we've put up with it despite Boone's desire to "play for championships" and by that he didn't mean the National Spelling Bee. We have this ingrown culture of putting up with mediocrity because we are too damn scared of Lewis Field and the past that we don't even realize we may be headed that way until it's too damn late, just like we let basketball go to the crapper before, hopefully, Boynton has it now turned around. Unfortunately, we can't afford our major revenue sport to go into the crapper or even near it just to pay Gundy another 3 years towards his retirement.
 
Aug 22, 2006
1,339
489
1,713
SE Oklahoma
We've heard that about to Oline since Wickline left and I hear people saying it about Gleason now in addition to Knowles. So that why I say it seems like we're stuck in perpetual "wait until they get their guys in there."
We've heard it about the O-Line coaches because we haven't had an o-line that have performed well consistently since Wickline was here. I don't think we have had an O-Linemen drafted since Wickline was here either. My point was actually about the defensive side of the ball. Arguable the best position on the defensive side has been the linebackers and they are coached by the newest hire on that side of the ball Jim Knowles. If the DB's actually played the ball every once in a while we would have a few more turnovers the past 2 years. Instead they run into guys trying to catch the ball and draw PI's, we've had talent in our DB's as evidenced by the guys that are on rosters/practice squads in the NFL they just have to be coached up when they get to the league. That's what I am referring to in particular.
 

Rob B.

I'm......Batman.
A/V Subscriber
Aug 13, 2007
46,707
26,818
1,743
Rockin' the GL.
Great he's in the 30-40s in recruiting rankings, and 5th in the conference the past 4 years, but, of course, under your selective criteria he's earning a top 15 salary for less than top 15 results. This is why our program is going stale and schools like even freaking KU are beating us in recruiting because we've put up with it despite Boone's desire to "play for championships" and by that he didn't mean the National Spelling Bee. We have this ingrown culture of putting up with mediocrity because we are too damn scared of Lewis Field and the past that we don't even realize we may be headed that way until it's too damn late, just like we let basketball go to the crapper before, hopefully, Boynton has it now turned around. Unfortunately, we can't afford our major revenue sport to go into the crapper or even near it just to pay Gundy another 3 years towards his retirement.
Dude, tell me someone you could (realisticly) bring to Stillwater and recruit better than that. I mean, sure, you might get a decent coach, in the form of Les Miles, who will stepping stone the hell out of us, but nobody is going to grab top 15 recruiting classes.
 

Rob B.

I'm......Batman.
A/V Subscriber
Aug 13, 2007
46,707
26,818
1,743
Rockin' the GL.
But we haven't been in trouble with the NCAA, and we have graduated and developed a bunch of great men, and who else are you going to get, and he's the 'winningest coach' in OSU history, recruiting stars and rankings don't mean anything, it's hard to get anyone to come to Stillwater, and we've gone to a bowl xxx times in a row and be careful what you ask for. Have I left off any of the deflective explanations for where we are now ? Rack might want to add a few.
That about covers it. I haven't seen you offer a solution yet.....Are you one of those bitcher and complainers Gundy was referring to?
 
Oct 7, 2015
1,811
1,113
243
St. Elmo, CO
You're right - not disclosed by Baylor, but Rhule signed a long term contract and he is no fool. Has to be somewhere at least approaching the Gundy range for him to commit long term and I bet the pay escalates over the life of the contract. $5 mil is a relatively average pay for the big conferences.
I'd venture to say Rhule is making more than Gundy. Baylor is a private school and they don't have to say what his salary is and probably won't because a lot of people connected to Baylor without access to information like Rhule's contract might get uspet that he's making as much as he is.
But, Rhule deserves whatever he's getting. He's in there taking a comatose Baylor on life support with rats jumping ship like crazy and he's turned them around in a mere fraction of the time that Gundy has had in Stillwater.

And don't give the the excuse that Waco is a lot easier to recruit to than Stillwater.
I just drove through the Baylor campus and it's probably just a step ahead of a campus in West Texas. It's got one or two nice, old buildings, but it's certainly not anything to get moist about. Granted, if you're a huge fan of parking structures -- then Baylor's your school. I wonder if they show those off during recruiting visits (Yeah, have you folks park in one of our luxurious parking villas and tell the attendant it's on us.")

And even my Baylor graduate cousins say that Waco has nothing going for it other than a place to get a huge Chicken Fried Steak (if that floats your boat -- and it's got to be better than Chili Cheese Fries).

Our campus towers over Baylor's campus. Stillwater is prettier IMHO than Waco, but neither one is known for it's nightlife.
 
Jul 9, 2011
2,356
1,380
743
64
Yankees Tavern, Carlos Texas
So your definition of complacency is:

Between 2005 and 2018 we have AVERAGED a third place finish in the Big 12. In other words we have AVERAGED being in the top tier of the league for 13 years. During MG's tenure we have been one of the best teams in the Big 12, period. This included two 1st place, four 2nd place and three 3rd place finishes.

He has the third highest salary in the Big 12 - justified. He has what would be an average salary in the SEC - 5 coaches make more and 2 make about the same - justified again. He has a respectable 2-3 record versus the SEC in bowls and is 4-4 overall versus the SEC.
 
Last edited:
Jul 9, 2011
2,356
1,380
743
64
Yankees Tavern, Carlos Texas
I'd venture to say Rhule is making more than Gundy. Baylor is a private school and they don't have to say what his salary is and probably won't because a lot of people connected to Baylor without access to information like Rhule's contract might get uspet that he's making as much as he is.
But, Rhule deserves whatever he's getting. He's in there taking a comatose Baylor on life support with rats jumping ship like crazy and he's turned them around in a mere fraction of the time that Gundy has had in Stillwater.

And don't give the the excuse that Waco is a lot easier to recruit to than Stillwater.
I just drove through the Baylor campus and it's probably just a step ahead of a campus in West Texas. It's got one or two nice, old buildings, but it's certainly not anything to get moist about. Granted, if you're a huge fan of parking structures -- then Baylor's your school. I wonder if they show those off during recruiting visits (Yeah, have you folks park in one of our luxurious parking villas and tell the attendant it's on us.")

And even my Baylor graduate cousins say that Waco has nothing going for it other than a place to get a huge Chicken Fried Steak (if that floats your boat -- and it's got to be better than Chili Cheese Fries).

Our campus towers over Baylor's campus. Stillwater is prettier IMHO than Waco, but neither one is known for it's nightlife.
I think early in the contract he is just below, but his pay increases year by year so who knows later.
 
Jun 4, 2014
935
696
643
Dallas, TX
It's pretty clear that guys like me (in my 50's) who have been around the program all their lives and have lived through many decades of really bad Oklahoma State football are clearly a little more patient with our head coach. That being said, I honestly do think we would suffer greatly from a head coaching change in the next year or so...in fact, I think it's inevitable that we will suffer when Gundy's tenure ends UNLESS we step up to the plate like Boone did in his lifetime in a big time way. It's going to take a major commitment like that (not sure how) to step up and be where we all want us to be. I think the heights to which he has taken us aren't something easy to replicate, not with just OU in the backyard, but Texas and other teams that have the ability to recruit in our neighborhood with much larger population centers and bigger home crowds on gamedays. One of the things that has always hurt us is the size of our fanbase...we need to continue to grow that. Tell me how you think our program needs to "adapt and move in a different direction" especially since the one we have been on has been so productive. I know that's a bit pessimistic, but I've been around a while.
In the Big 12 alone we have 4 great examples of coaching changes working out almost immediately. Texas, OU, Baylor, and ISU. I don't buy the "the sky will fall if we fire Gundy". And are you seriously insinuating that we don't have the funding for a top coach? Like others have said, we are clearly able to pay for this level of success judging by Gundy being a top 15 paid coach.

I understand there is a lot of competition for talent, but everyone has to compete. And if we settle into a feeling that "we can't compete with those guys, so why try", we have already committed to mediocrity. This is what Gundy has done, and will be his undoing. And I hope we can wake up soon enough for it not to be the program's undoing as well.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.